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Monday, March 14, 2005

Berlinski: I can't believe I'm wasting time on this guy.

Echoed on the Panda's Thumb

David Berlinski is babbling against evolution again (an abridged version has been published in the Wichita Eagle), and it's dreadful. This is a guy who is a competent mathematician with a degree from Princeton, and all he can do is whip out creationist lies in a lather of fury against Darwin. I've tried to dissect it as well as I can, while trying to choke back the nausea induced by such putrid arguments.

The defense of Darwin’s theory of evolution has now fallen into the hands of biologists who believe in suppressing criticism when possible and ignoring it when not. It is not a strategy calculated in induce confidence in the scientific method. A paper published recently in the Proceedings of the Biological Society of Washington concluded that the events taking place during the Cambrian era could best be understood in terms of an intelligent design – hardly a position unknown in the history of western science. The paper was, of course, peer-reviewed by three prominent evolutionary biologists. Wise men attend to the publication of every one of the Proceeding’s papers, but in the case of Steven Meyer’s "The origin of biological information and the higher taxonomic categories," the Board of Editors was at once given to understand that they had done a bad thing. Their indecent capitulation followed at once.

Publication of the paper, they confessed, was a mistake. It would never happen again. It had barely happened at all. And peer review?

The hell with it.

“If scientists do not oppose antievolutionism,” Eugenie Scott, the Executive Director of the National Center for Science Education, remarked, “it will reach more people with the mistaken idea that evolution is scientifically weak.” Scott’s understanding of ‘opposition’ had nothing to do with reasoned discussion. It had nothing to do with reason at all. Discussing the issue was out of the question. Her advice to her colleagues was considerably more to the point: "Avoid debates."

There is a serious question of strategy here, and I go back and forth on it myself. Creationism is nothing but nonsense, and it has no legitimacy to debate. So should we debate it or not? Giving them a reasonable forum gives them more credibility than they deserve. Ignoring them allows them to shriek unanswered. I don't know which is worse.

We've been all over the Meyer affair. It was a bad paper snuck into a journal with the collusion of a fellow traveler in the ID game. Every scientist has had papers rejected; you patch up the flaws and resubmit. I think the Discovery Institute knows this particular paper is irreparable, so all they can do is assume a martyr's pose and whine about it.

Everyone else had better shut up.

In this country, at least, no one is ever going to shut up, the more so since the case against Darwin’s theory retains an almost lunatic vitality.

Don't be humble, David: I'll grant that it is a completely lunatic vitality.

Now Berlinski cranks up the gait and breaks into the traditional Gish Gallop of all creationists, rattling off garbage at a pace that's hard to match, when one is trying to be honest. It really is no fair that creationists do not have the handicap of being accurate or truthful.

Look – The suggestion that Darwin’s theory of evolution is like theories in the serious sciences – quantum electrodynamics, say – is grotesque. Quantum electrodynamics is accurate to thirteen unyielding decimal places. Darwin’s theory makes no tight quantitative predictions at all.

We do not measure the validity of a theory by how many decimal places can be calculated for some arbitrary formula within it. Berlinski has a childishly naive view of how science works.

One piece of crap we should get out of way immediately is this "Darwin's theory" nonsense. We are not dealing with "Darwin's theory" anymore, but a much greater body of knowledge and concepts that has accumulated in the past century and a half, which includes one huge revision (the incorporation of genetics and population genetics) in the past, and which is being constantly updated right now. It is absolutely idiotic to criticize modern biology on the basis of one's misunderstanding of a preliminary proposal published in 1859. But this is the strategy that the IDiots have taken. It is insane.

This complaint that results in evolution have too few significant digits is also insane. One of the things even (especially?) physicists learn early in their training is to use an appropriate level of accuracy; using more digits than is warranted by the accuracy of one's measurements is unscientific. When you are dealing with a population of 106 individuals, it would be ridiculous to use the Hardy-Weinberg formula to estimate gene frequencies in the next generation to 1 in 1013, and it would also require ignoring the noise and statistical properties of what we are measuring.

There's also a serious problem in the logic of his argument. Meteorologists also deal with complex phenomena and can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance. This does not mean it is not a science, nor does it lend credibility to the idea that lightning is caused by the anger of Thor.

Look – Field studies attempting to measure natural selection inevitably report weak to non-existent selection effects.

Why shouldn't evolutionists debate creationists? Because creationists say things that are this stupid, that are wrong on multiple levels. If I were standing on a podium with Berlinski, at this point I'd be tempted to pick up a book (something massive, like Gould's Structure of Evolutionary Theory) and throw it at him.

On one level, this is not a damaging observation at all. We do not expect everything to have a strong selection effect, and we expect most phenomena to be selectively neutral. This is like criticizing physicist's understanding of gravity because we weigh less on the moon, and we aren't all crushed into a thin pulpy layer of slime by the force of Earth's gravity.

Another problem is that it is a fucking lie.

Strong selection effects have been measured, for example in bacteria in response to antibiotics, and in insects in response to insectides, for instance in measurements of the frequency of allelic variants of the acetylcholinesterase gene in mosquitos.

So what should I do in a debate with some sleaze like Berlinski, who pulls this kind of dishonest crap? Spend 20 minutes teaching the audience about Hardy-Weinberg, pull up the results of a half dozen studies, and get all technical and detailed? Or walk across the room, beat him unconscious with any one of hundreds of readily available books that demonstrate his dishonesty, and kick him until he pukes? The latter is very tempting.

Look – Darwin’s theory is open at one end since there are no plausible account for the origins of life.

It's open at the other end, since we don't know where life is going, either. And there are all kinds of gaps in the middle, because we aren't omniscient. So?

Science makes no claim of completeness. This is true of not just biology, but also physics, chemistry, geology, psychology, sociology…you name it.

And once again, in addition to completely missing the point, he's lying again. There are plenty of plausible theories of abiogenesis. The problem is in resolving which is the most likely, working out the details, figuring out how chemical evolution links up with biological evolution, and testing many of the ideas. All of the ideas coming out of the chemistry labs pursuing abiogenesis are far more robust and more productive and more plausible than the silliness hatched out of the Discovery Institute.

Look – The astonishing and irreducible complexity of various cellular structures has not yet successfully been described, let alone explained.

Give me a break. Irreducibility has been thoroughly debunked as a property that would invalidate evolution.

Look – A great many species enter the fossil record trailing no obvious ancestors and depart for Valhalla leaving no obvious descendents.

Name one.

It's not surprising that many leave no descendants: we expect that on a branching bush, many will be terminal twigs. But he will not be able to name a single species that has been studied that does not show deep, fundamental relationships to all other species.

Look – Where attempts to replicate Darwinian evolution on the computer have been successful, they have not used classical Darwinian principles, and where they have used such principles, they have not been successful.

This is precisely backwards. The major complaint biologists have about successful simulations, such as Avida, is that they rely too much on Darwinian selection. Berlinski's complaint here simply does not make sense.

Look – Tens of thousands of fruit flies have come and gone in laboratory experiments, and every last one of them has remained a fruit fly to the end, all efforts to see the miracle of speciation unavailing.

For a mathematician who likes to babble about the importance of 13 significant digits, he sure likes to pull bogus numbers out of his butt. In my little genetics class at a small, out-of-the-way university, we rip through 10,000 fruit flies in a single semester, easily.

And, as we have come to expect in this little essay, Berlinski combines both egregious misconceptions and outright lies in his claim. We do not expect fruit flies to become anything other than fruit flies in the mere century of research we have carried out. What does he expect, flies to give birth to cats?

Of course speciation has been observed. Multiple times. In nature and the lab.

Look – The remarkable similarity in the genome of a great many organisms suggests that there is at bottom only one living system; but how then to account for the astonishing differences between human beings and their near relatives – differences that remain obvious to anyone who has visited a zoo?

Similarity is not identity.

It really is that simple, Mr Berlinski. Are you that obtuse that this simple concept evades you?

Human and chimpanzee genomes are very similar to one another, but there are significant differences. Human and chimpanzee genomes also have some distant similarities with the Drosophila genome, but the differences are much greater.

Human and chimpanzee morphologies are very similar to one another, but there are significant differences. Human and chimpanzee morphologies also have some distant similarities with Drosophila morphology, but the differences are much greater.

But look again – If the differences between organisms are scientifically more interesting than their genomic similarities, of what use is Darwin’s theory since it’s otherwise mysterious operations take place by genetic variations?

What the hell…?

This doesn't even make sense; all I can imagine is that Berlinski, sitting in his little fantasy bubble, imagining how biology works without ever consulting reality, has drifted off into some bizarre alien plane where he is now warring with his own misconceptions.

The differences are interesting. The similarities are interesting. The differences and similarities are maintained and generated by evolutionary mechanisms (please, not "Darwin", who didn't even have a theory of genetics).

Does anyone understand what Berlinski is chittering about here? Is it possible that clouting him over the head with Gould's mega-book has caused brain damage?

These are hardly trivial questions. Each suggests a dozen others. These are hardly circumstances that do much to support the view that there are “no valid criticisms of Darwin’s theory,” as so many recent editorials have suggested.

Serious biologists quite understand all this. They rather regard Darwin’s theory as an elderly uncle invited to a family dinner. The old boy has no hair, he has no teeth, he is hard of hearing, and he often drools. Addressing even senior members at table as Sonny, he is inordinately eager to tell the same story over and over again.

But he’s family. What can you do?

Who is Berlinski to speak of "serious biologists"? I know many serious biologists. All take evolutionary biology quite seriously, and understand it quite well as a substantial, powerful tool.

And only gibbering creationists make this foolish mistake of yammering about "Darwin's theory" when they are talking about the whole of modern biology.

Berlinski has convinced me. Eugenie Scott is right and public, formal debates with these cretins should be avoided. I look at the strings of lies he'd be shitting out on the stage, and I don't see why I should subject myself or an audience to that kind of revolting spectacle.

And yes, I am angry. This is what us American biologists have to deal with?


Sweet galumphing Jebus. It has just been pointed out to me that Berlinski's latest book, The Secrets of the Vaulted Sky, is a defense of astrology. Now I feel even worse about wasting time on this clown.


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Comments:
#18591: — 03/14  at  03:29 PM
And yes, I am angry. This is what biologists have to deal with?


It seems a mostly US phenomenom, so not all biologists have to bother with this kind of nonsense.



#18592: Ron Zeno — 03/14  at  03:31 PM
"It really is no fair that creationists do not have the handicap of being accurate or truthful."

It's fair as long as it's made clear that the Intelligent Design Creationists have decided to not be accurate or truthful.

Yes, it's a waste of time to debate them or otherwise meet them on their terms. However, it's useful for all to make those terms apparent for what they are: attempts at deception.



#18595: DarkSyde — 03/14  at  03:49 PM
So sad. A Tour of the Calculus was such a wonderfully written book, mixing in history, with personalities and enough analysis that the reader could understand it all as a single process. Then he sells out like this.

I too, have a debate within myself. Do these guys see themselves as scientists or PR hacks? We don't think of an advertising firm, that markets Pepsi by showing bikini clad gals slicked down in suntan oil playing volleyball and drinking Pepsi, as dishonest or as liars. Do these guys like Berlinksi and Behe see themselves that way also?



#18598: Jim Foley — 03/14  at  03:56 PM
Paul, you said:

Berlinski has convinced me. Eugenie Scott is right and public, formal debates with these cretins should be avoided. I look at the strings of lies he'd be shitting out on the stage, and I don't see why I should subject myself or an audience to that kind of revolting spectacle.

Apropos of which, maybe you've forgotten the Firing Line debate of 8 years ago? (William Buckley, Berlinski, Behe and Phillip Johnson against Barry Lynn, Eugenie Scott, Michael Ruse and Ken Miller) Berlinski was oozing this sort of crap, with the air of someone descended from Olympus and casting pearls of wisdom before the swine. Ken Miller did the debating equivalent of smashing a brick into his smarmy face and made him look like a blithering idiot. It was very sweet. The transcript doesn't quite do it justice, you have to see the video to appreciate it in all its glory.



#18599: — 03/14  at  03:58 PM
It is useless to debate biology with creationists, but unfortunately we must continue to engage them politically, as made obvious by this morning's article in the Washington Post. We cannot allow religious fanatics to undermine science education and research in this country. Effective science education is the key.



#18600: DarkSyde — 03/14  at  04:00 PM
JIM:

I wouldn't mind seeing that very Video, and posting a link to it my Blog if someone could find it online or put it online.



#18601: — 03/14  at  04:09 PM
It really is infuriating, isn't it?

Unfortunately, this sort of nonsense is far from unique among the IDiots. One would think that Commandment about not bearing false witness means what it says.

The Daily Duck took a whack at Berlinski. While none of there are professional biologists, they seem to have done credible job repudiating some of his egregious nonsense.

BTW--I don't comment much, but that doesn't mean I don't read everything here and at Panda's Thumb. Keep up the great work, please.



#18602: — 03/14  at  04:11 PM
"Look – Where attempts to replicate Darwinian evolution on the computer have been successful, they have not used classical Darwinian principles, and where they have used such principles, they have not been successful. "

As PZ already pointed out, maybe it is because it uses *Neo-Darwinian* priciples incorporating genetics, not "Classic" ones, whatever they are.

Argghhhhh!

Or is this finely crafted obfuscation deliberate?



#18603: — 03/14  at  04:13 PM
DSyde

"We don't think of an advertising firm, that markets Pepsi by showing bikini clad gals slicked down in suntan oil playing volleyball and drinking Pepsi, as dishonest or as liars."

Hey, speak for yourself! I happen to think that advertising firms who use sex to sell sugar water ARE dishonest liars. On the other hand, I like looking at hot women in wet T-shirts so I am not as annoyed by ad firms as I am by anti-nipple creationists.

This reminds me: all of you Pharyngula fans simply MUST SEE the retrospective DVD which features the best of Bill Hicks. Among other routines, he rips a new one for George Bush Sr. and the first Iraq war, jokes which are eerily relevant today but which -- sadly -- are rarely heard on television today. Plus tons of great jokes at the expense of ignorant religionists. Where have all the great comics gone?



#18604: — 03/14  at  04:15 PM
All these guys use the same playbook - creationists and republicans alike. The main plan is to simply lie. They know that if you tell a lie often enough, a lot of people will believe it. Hmmm. Seems to me there was another political party that used that technique a few decades ago.



's avatar #18605: PZ Myers — 03/14  at  04:28 PM
Oh, no, Jim, I distinctly remember the firing line 'debate', and Berlinski drooling all over himself. That's one of the reasons I can't believe we're still dealing with him.

PZ Myers
Division of Science and Math
University of Minnesota, Morris



#18606: — 03/14  at  04:35 PM
Unfortunately, if you don't debate these fringe folk, many among the lay masses will wonder: "Why are the so-called experts ignoring them? Are they afraid of something?" Unfortunate and irritating, I realize, but I think that's the bind you're in. I do recall a PBS debate, hosted by Michael Kinsley, featuring a group of IDers (Berlinski and Philip Johnson among them) and a group of genuine scientists. The scientists appeared (to this layperson) to have wiped the floor w/ Berlinski and company. Kinsley obviously thought so as well. So debate needn't be a waste of breath.



#18608: — 03/14  at  04:37 PM
I only just bothered to look at the other comments. Maybe it was the Firing Line debate that I was thinking of.



#18614: Steve Reuland — 03/14  at  04:52 PM
Does anyone understand what Berlinski is chittering about here?


I strongly suspect that this is some bastardized version of Jonathan Wells' claim that DNA isn't really responsible for the differences between organisms (or something), and that since "Darwinism" is based on changes in DNA, then it cannot account for the differences between organisms (or something).

Problems with this line of argument:

1. Darwinian evolution is not strictly based on DNA, just on heritable traits, whether they come from DNA or from elsewhere. Most differences beween species are obviously heritable.

2. The basic claim that DNA is anything other than a major player in determining the differences between organisms is false.

3. The claim that there are other "interesting" things besides DNA that determine how organisms differ is true but trivial. DNA does not do everything itself, but nearly everything can be traced back to differences in DNA.

While I strongly suspect this is what Berlinkski was getting at, it's impossible to know for sure. Being vague and ambiguous means never having to say you're sorry.



#18619: Joe — 03/14  at  05:09 PM
Look – The remarkable similarity in the genome of a great many organisms suggests that there is at bottom only one living system; but how then to account for the astonishing differences between human beings and their near relatives – differences that remain obvious to anyone who has visited a zoo?


Substituting regulatory elements, Hox, maternal, segmentatian etc genes for architects and town planners, and substituting the rest of the genes for steel, bricks, stone, glass and wood, I ask:
The remarkable similarity between the building materials of a great many cities suggests that there is at bottom only one city system; but how then to account for the astonishing differences between London and New York - differences that remain obvious to anyone who has visited them.


I know enough Maths to know I'm far from qualified to question established theories, Berlinski clearly doesn't even know that much basic genetics--genetics that I'm sure all regular readers of Pharyngula have picked up.



#18620: Michael Koppelman — 03/14  at  05:09 PM
You know what we should do is stop calling it Intelligent Design and go back to calling it Creationism. They are winning the debate on the context of the debate by tricking us into calling it intelligent design...

Berlinski is doing the same thing by calling what PZ terms the whole of modern biology "Darwin's theory". He knows he sounds a lot dumber if he calls it evolutionary biology.



#18623: Gary Farber — 03/14  at  05:18 PM
"Eugenie Scott is right and public, formal debates with these cretins should be avoided. I look at the strings of lies he'd be shitting out on the stage, and I don't see why I should subject myself or an audience to that kind of revolting spectacle."

If we stipulate that any of those surveys as to how many Americans believe in creationism, or biblical literalness, or don't believe in evolution, are somewhere in the neighborhood of accurate, the reason would be to try to bring facts to the attention of those who don't possess them. Simply pretending this is not a wide-spread, dangerous, phenomenon won't help. I realize it's frustrating, but I can't see how it isn't necessary to respond; thinking it isn't necessary would simply be wishful thinking.



#18630: — 03/14  at  05:55 PM
Hey, PZ. What I have been wondering is, "Shouldn't we be sending these observations to the newspaper in the form of letters or counter 'editorials?'

It is fine to blast him here, or PT, or TO, or II, but so what? The people we need to reach are the rubes that read the newspaper that printed that crap.

Just a thought.

Gary



#18631: RPM — 03/14  at  05:56 PM
Darwinian evolution is not strictly based on DNA, just on heritable traits, whether they come from DNA or from elsewhere.

Heritable traits, by definition, come from DNA. Also, people often misuse the term "heritable." Heritability is a measure of the amount of variation of a trait in a population attributable to genetic variation. For example, the more phenotypic plasticity, the less heritable a trait. Heritability does not mean whether or not a trait is "inherited," and is not transferable between populations or groups with different allele frequencies. It is also dependent on genetic variation, and it's an extremely limited measure.
In my little genetics class at a small, out-of-the-way university, we rip through 10,000 fruit flies in a single semester, easily.

I doubt you use fruit flies in your genetics course. You use Drosophila melanogaster, which is not a fruit fly. Sorry, but this is a pet peeve of mine. In fact, I just told my students today that if they refer to Drosophila as fruit flies in their lab reports, I'd dock them points. I'm such as ass hole.

By the way, both of these points are extremely trivial.

but how then to account for the astonishing differences between human beings and their near relatives – differences that remain obvious to anyone who has visited a zoo?

On a more serious note, humans and chimps really aren't that different. I like refering to hominids as "hairless apes;" it really puts our position in the primate clade in perspective. This whole "humans are so different from all other mammals/primates" thing is utter bull shit. It's an anthro-centric view of biology, and totally inappropriate for any real evolutionary biologists to say. I love pointing out how there is more genetic diversity in the genus Drosophila than among all mammals -- we're much more similar to a dog or cat than Drosophila are to Mosquitos.



#18635: — 03/14  at  06:34 PM
>Re: #19: RPM

"Heritable traits, by definition, come from DNA."

Um, no, heritable traits by definition are just traits that are evident in descendants - DNA is just the mechanism of this inheritance! It is perfectly possible to imagine that another mechanism could accomplish the same thing. Much of the point of the arguments is that the structure and effect of inherited traits can be analyzed and hypothesized about without knowing anything about DNA.

To say otherwiseone would have to assumethat Darwin could not have written "Origin of Species" because genetics was not known in 1859 - as PZ has already said.



's avatar #18637: PZ Myers — 03/14  at  06:44 PM
Gary, no one is arguing that we shouldn't have educational outreach to the public, or that we shouldn't be trying to publicly counter the nonsense we're getting from creationists. What we're opposing is allowing them to dictate the terms of the discussion. They want public debates, because they then get to stand side-by-side with real scientists in the public eye.

They don't even care if they lose. Every time they've been engaged in debate, as in the Firing Line debacle and the AMNH debates, they come back afterwards and announce their increase in credibility.

PZ Myers
Division of Science and Math
University of Minnesota, Morris



#18642: John Wendt — 03/14  at  07:26 PM
We do not measure the validity of a theory by how many decimal places can be calculated for some arbitrary formula within it.
More to the point, I suggest, is that physics deals precisely and narrowly with those things that can be accurately measured. Biology takes a somewhat orthogonal approach, dealing with an area of nature -- living things -- and uses whatever methods will help with insight, including the methods of physics, which can help with part but not all of the story.

Unfortunately, what goes by the name "philosophy of science" is mainly philosophy of physics. Biology is relegated to the "special sciences".



#18647: — 03/14  at  07:58 PM
C Shuyler

"Unfortunately, if you don't debate these fringe folk, many among the lay masses will wonder: 'Why are the so-called experts ignoring them? Are they afraid of something?'."

It's a reasonable question. Of course, as discussed in PZ's post and in this thread, there's a very reasonable and honest explanation that can be given whenever the refusal to debate is granted. If some member of the "lay masses" is too stupid to understand or believe this explanation, then they are too stupid to appreciate or understand the credibility of the participants in any debate and are more likely to make their decision by who is wearing the more prominent cross or who has better hair. I say: screw 'em, in the courts and in the halls of Congress, where it matters. Our Federal Judges and Congressmen are not nearly as dumb -- on average -- as the morons who peddle ID. That's why the Discovery Institute so desperately wants to get stupider script-reciting Congressmen and women elected to office.

Can you imagine a debate in the Senate today on whether evolutionary biology is a fraud perpetuated by scientists to advance their secular humanist cause??? I would love to see that. There is a good reason why such a debate has not occurred: no Senator wants to have his or her intellect publicly ridiculed. Unlike Dembski and Behe and the other "big name" charlatans, Senators don't need to make up baloney in order to "be somebody." They need to make up baloney in order to get re-elected. But living in the 21st century means that some of the baloney has to please people who know a lot about science and technology.

"Mysterious aliens created all the life on earth somehow -- this is a serious scientific theory that we should teach kids" just isn't going to cut it. It makes "we didn't know cigarettes were addictive" sound reasonable.



#18648: Murph — 03/14  at  08:13 PM
"But he will not be able to name a single species that has been studied that does not show deep, fundamental relationships to all other species."

Pokemon? Maybe that can be his next book.

D



#18651: — 03/14  at  08:34 PM
Meteorologists also deal with complex phenomena and can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance. This does not mean it is not a science, nor does it lend credibility to the idea that lightning is caused by the anger of Thor.


Well, duh. Lightning is caused by the anger of Zeus, a sort of trumped-up oak hero of the same basic type as worshipped by the cults of Jehovah and Jeshua-Jesus. Sheesh, get with it, Scandanavia.



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