Pharyngula::Democrats who cheese me off

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Sunday, November 06, 2005

Democrats who cheese me off

PZ Myers • 28 Comments (last page)

Julia had to remind of a Democrat I can't stand—not in the fierce, angry way of some conservative fraud who calls himself a Democrat (a Zell Miller, for instance), but the kind who are legitimate members who somehow bumble along incompetently, screwing the party from the inside. I've got two who annoy me every time they come up.

Joe Biden. He's a pompous hack who thinks caving to the opposition is synonymous with statesmanship, and he slavers over any bone the media throws to him as a reward for his role as the Republican lapdog.
John Kerry. I'm a little embarrassed by this one—I voted for him, I'd vote for him again today, and I think he's a decent human being, but every time Bush screws up, I get this email from him telling me we've got to do something. I'm beginning to associate every idiot move Bush makes with Kerry's failure.

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Comments:

#47361: Bob Davis — 11/06 at 05:59 PM
As I wrote this morning on a DKos open thread:

Biden sucks.

While he occasionally has something interesting to say, he more than makes up for it with his asshatnesses.

#47365: John — 11/06 at 06:36 PM
Biden's way is to surrender before a battle is even begun, and that plays right into Republican hands. The Democrats are not going to get back into a majority unless they start showing some spine, and they can't show spine unless they stand together. Rolling over and playing dead is not going to help anything.

I dread another Kerry for President campaign. I voted for him last November, and I agree with him on many issues, but we need a better candidate than this.

#47369: — 11/06 at 07:06 PM
Kerry, Biden, Lieberman - political invertebrates

#47370: coturnix — 11/06 at 07:08 PM
I also despise Biden, especially since early 1990s when he was on TV every night spouting nonsense about the Balkan campaign. I guess he was called up every night because he is supposed to be some kind of foreign policy expert - yeah, right, he's the Creationist of foreign policy.

#47371: — 11/06 at 07:11 PM
"I dread another Kerry for President campaign. I voted for him last November, and I agree with him on many issues, but we need a better candidate than this."

I think some fraction of dissatisfaction with Democratic candidates is that it's hard to filter out the Republican noise machine, and it's hard to hear what the Democrats are saying. I think a lot of Democratic politicians say a lot of gutsy things that are never heard, and have no impact because the media consistently downplays them. I bought into some amount of the sturm und drang over Clinton and what-will-we-tell-the-children, because I didn't realize how much a coordinated campaign of bullshit it was. Never again.

#47382: AndyS — 11/06 at 08:50 PM
Everyone in the senate seems tainted -- Biden perhaps more than most. Hillary? No, I'm not into dynasties. Don't like the Bush one, won't like a Clinton one. Give me Edwards. Even better give me someone new -- I think his trial lawyer baggage is more than the system will bear.

When asked about Western civilization Ghandi said, ‘I think it would be a good idea.’

#47383: — 11/06 at 08:52 PM
Got to agree with Taury…

No such list is complete without Lieberman.

#47385: — 11/06 at 09:09 PM

Give me Edwards. Even better give me someone new -- I think his trial lawyer baggage is more than the system will bear.

Somebuddy make an objection to Edwards that isn't "he's a lawyer." Is that all there is? Christ, he's a lawyer using his privileged position to reduce poverty, for Jebus sake. Someone please explain why having a career involving intense evalutation of arguments is a bad thing for a politician . . .

#47386: — 11/06 at 09:11 PM
evaluation, I mean.

#47387: decrepitoldfool — 11/06 at 09:16 PM
Teddy Kennedy. He is an embarassment. During the Roberts hearings, he said blah-blah-blah and used up all his time, and forgot to ask a question of the nominee. Sadly, this is typical of him.

If I can't have Bill Clinton back then I don't know who I want. He would be the guy to repair relations with our allies, push (again) for a balanced budget, and cut down on the religiously-inspired discrimination that has crept back into American society.

So I guess, somebody like Bill. I can't get a bead on whether Hillary could do that.

#47388: — 11/06 at 09:17 PM
Kerry's failure? Granted, only Dean and Sharpton brought their balls to the primary debate, but I wouldn't go so far as to call Kerry a failure. He whooped Bush's ass in the debates, and the main reason he lost is because Bush stole Ohio via election fraud. That said, we should have stuck with Dean.

#47389: coturnix — 11/06 at 09:23 PM
This article argues that in the post-Katrina world (and I would also add post-Scooter, DeLay, Frist- world), Edwards being a lawyer is a PLUS!

#47392: — 11/06 at 09:48 PM

The antiwar wing of the Democratic Party will continue to wonder why Edwards voted in support of the Iraq war in 2003. It's impossible to know what will be happening in Iraq come 2008, but that is nevertheless a good question, and here's a working answer: "Events on the ground have shown that George Bush's Iraq war was a tragic mistake in judgement on his part, and it was a mistake to support it. I thought I was doing the right thing by the country at the time I voted in favor of the war."

Umm, that's the problem with the Dems - a conciliatory position on the war built on lies. However, it's not "impossible to know what will be happening in Iraq come 2008." Civil war, as now and so it will be then. A civil war we started. The only thing the war supporters have is . . . . "flip-flopping?" Hello, remember Emerson's "a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds?" Isn't changing ones' mind in light of new evidence the method of science, and a damn good path to follow?

#47393: coturnix — 11/06 at 09:53 PM
Unlike Kerry, Edwards has actually stated that knowing what he knows now he would have NOT voited for the war. I have recently linked to several bloggers who commented on this.

#47396: — 11/06 at 10:06 PM
So I see, Coturnix. If that's aimed at me, I've no beef with Edwards. As your coverage has shown, he's doing quite a lot. Real stuff, reducing poverty in eastern NC and all. But he's a *gasp* lawyer! What a rebuttal that is!

That said I still expect the opposition party to throw some weight against this war, and I'll remain critical of any Dem who doesn't state frankly and loudly that Bush is a lying murderous lunatic.

(back to reading your aforementioned links . . .)

#47397: Arun — 11/06 at 10:07 PM
John wrote The Democrats are not going to get back into a majority unless they start showing some spine, and they can't show spine unless they stand together.

It is a sad party whose members can show spine only by standing together. I thought the real test of spine was the willingness to stand alone.

#47402: coturnix — 11/06 at 10:23 PM
Jamie, that was not aimed at you in particular - I just thought I'd throw that link in for the discussion.

#47407: ekzept — 11/06 at 10:40 PM
i see no socially redeeming values in the Democrats as a group. i utterly despise the Republicans, except perhaps for Christie Whitman and her ilk. the only real leader with vision the Democrats have is Bill Clinton, and he's been marginalized, so they keep trotting Kerry out.

sadly, because it's bound to take a long time, i don't think we'll be saved from the Republicans until a new party comes along to replace the Democrats. they are dead. Clinton was the only one who saw what they needed to become, and the Republicans destroyed him because of it.

the politically dashing move in 2008 belongs to the rapid Republicans, nominating Condie Rice as their Prez candidate, and clutching the White prize for Republications, conservatives, women, and blacks, all in one stroke.

#47421: Mitchell Freedman — 11/07 at 12:06 AM
Biden is becoming the new Zell Miller. I am starting to expect that he will show up with Ron Silver at the Republican National Convention in 2008 to say, "I didn't leave the Democrats. They left me."

I'll make it easy for you, Joe. Get out now. Really. No kidding. Now.

#47435: — 11/07 at 05:36 AM
Christie Whitman did a wonderful job taking power in NJ as a tax-cutter, destroyer of public education. Being not as extreme as Bush hardly makes her a desirable candidate

#47440: Michael Koppelman — 11/07 at 07:56 AM
Biden is not great but I'm suprised how much you guys don't like him. He does stand up to the Right now and again. Kerry is OK but I will not vote for him if he runs again. He is a coward and cannot for the life of him talk straight.

Oh, how I miss Paul Wellstone....

#47447: Keith Douglas — 11/07 at 09:01 AM
I'll say it again: The US has two major parties:

the Plutocratic Party
the Theocratic Plutocratic Party

#47464: The Commissar — 11/07 at 10:33 AM
Looking at this from the other side (I'm a Rethuglican, or maybe a 'Repug," I forget.) ... while I'm delighted to see my adversaries 'cheese each other off,' or whatever you Libs do ...

Maybe Biden doesn't want a protracted discussion that could lead to more focus on 'spousal notification.' The glare of hearings can bring new attention to heretofore minor issues, e.g. the Thomas hearings and sexual harassment.

Just looking at it tactically, you guys may NOT WANT a huge high-intensity battle, in which the words "spousal notification" (supported by 70% of the people) would get lots and lots of air time.

#47467: MBains — 11/07 at 11:12 AM
Uh... hey Commish, why does this particular issue have you stuck on equating popularity with constitutionality? I didn't you leaned that way boss.

but every time Bush screws up, I get this email from him telling me we've got to do something.

I found a way to alleviate the aggravation of all those emails: they get delivered to an E-addy I only check twice a week. It's much easier to decide whether or not it's a waste of time to read them that way.

#47480: — 11/07 at 12:57 PM
Joe Biden and Joe Lieberman are perfect examples of why I've never been able to very comfortably consider myself a Democrat. I'm a civil liberties guy first and foremost, and anyone pushing the "drug war" or "public morality" is high on my shit list.

I've become a hardcore Dem by default during the Bush catastrophe, but as soon as I'm not distracted by my seething hatred of the current adminstration quite so much I'll probably revert back to being angry at the Dems most of the time as well.

Sigh... if only I knew how good I had it back when I had the luxury of hating the Dems too.

Those were good times.

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Sunday, November 06, 2005

Democrats who cheese me off

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