Pharyngula

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Tuesday, February 01, 2005

We're losing, you know

From the NY Times:

Dr. John Frandsen, a retired zoologist, was at a dinner for teachers in Birmingham, Ala., recently when he met a young woman who had just begun work as a biology teacher in a small school district in the state. Their conversation turned to evolution.

"She confided that she simply ignored evolution because she knew she'd get in trouble with the principal if word got about that she was teaching it," he recalled. "She told me other teachers were doing the same thing."

Even where evolution is taught, teachers may be hesitant to give it full weight. Ron Bier, a biology teacher at Oberlin High School in Oberlin, Ohio, said that evolution underlies many of the central ideas of biology and that it is crucial for students to understand it. But he avoids controversy, he said, by teaching it not as "a unit," but by introducing the concept here and there throughout the year. "I put out my little bits and pieces wherever I can," he said.

He noted that his high school, in a college town, has many students whose parents are professors who have no problem with the teaching of evolution. But many other students come from families that may not accept the idea, he said, "and that holds me back to some extent."

"I don't force things," Mr. Bier added. "I don't argue with students about it."

All true, and it has been true for a long time. Evolution wasn't mentioned even once in my high school days. Not once. It's ignored in my kids' high school.

And this despite the fact that…

There is no credible scientific challenge to the idea that all living things evolved from common ancestors, that evolution on earth has been going on for billions of years and that evolution can be and has been tested and confirmed by the methods of science.

And this despite the fact that…

These findings set the United States apart from all other industrialized nations, said Dr. Jon Miller, director of the Center for Biomedical Communications at Northwestern University, who has studied public attitudes toward science. Americans, he said, have been evenly divided for years on the question of evolution, with about 45 percent accepting it, 45 percent rejecting it and the rest undecided.

In other industrialized countries, Dr. Miller said, 80 percent or more typically accept evolution, most of the others say they are not sure and very few people reject the idea outright.

"In Japan, something like 96 percent accept evolution," he said. Even in socially conservative, predominantly Catholic countries like Poland, perhaps 75 percent of people surveyed accept evolution, he said. "It has not been a Catholic issue or an Asian issue," he said.

Indeed, two popes, Pius XII in 1950 and John Paul II in 1996, have endorsed the idea that evolution and religion can coexist. "I have yet to meet a Catholic school teacher who skips evolution," Dr. Scott said.

It's also no consolation to tell you all that they are coming for you next.

But several experts say scientists are feeling increasing pressure to make their case, in part, Dr. Miller said, because scriptural literalists are moving beyond evolution to challenge the teaching of geology and physics on issues like the age of the earth and the origin of the universe.

"They have now decided the Big Bang has to be wrong," he said. "There are now a lot of people who are insisting that that be called only a theory without evidence and so on, and now the physicists are getting mad about this."

Look at us. We should be so ashamed. This country is an embarrassment.

"Wise men lay up knowledge, but the babbling of a fool brings ruin near."
"But I say that wisdom is better than might, though the poor man's wisdom is despised, and his words are not heeded. The words of the wise heard in quiet are better than the shouting of a ruler among fools. Wisdom is better than weapons of war, but one sinner destroys much good."

We've got to change tactics. We need to get much more aggressive in forcing these issues in our schools—it's like watching whole generations of our kid spiralling down the drain.


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Comments:
#15028: — 02/02  at  01:47 AM
And of course by "answer" I mean question. We need a post modification option.



#15029: — 02/02  at  02:44 AM
Bryson Brown is right about Richard. If a war broke out, I'd be on the side that was right. If it was Britain's War of Independence from a fascist USA, I'd support Britain. If it was a neo-colonial attempt by Britain to incorporate the USA into the Commonwealth, I'd be on the American side.

Ginger Yellow, in Israel evolution is not as controversial as in the USA, but you don't have to take biology in high school at all, and one ultra-religious party mocked evolution in its campaign commercials back in 1999, putting a picture of a chimp with the caption, "grandfather," with the narrating rabbi saying, "everybody knows the world was created in six days."

Shaggy Maniac, I'm not proposing that high schools not teach science. I'm proposing that they focus on science as a process, as you say, rather than just teaching students names of phyla and their characteristics. I'm proposing that they focus on why things in history happen rather than on memorizing dates.



#15032: — 02/02  at  04:31 AM
Richard, I don't accept the premise of your question, and I resent your monopolising of Americanness, but I'll answer it anyway. In principle, I'd side with the country that I thought was in the right, as I would in any conflict. For example, I like to think I'd have joined the International Brigades in Spain in the 30s, although obviously I might not have. In practice, however, I'd probably do whatever it took to protect my family. I'm only human.

Jeebus: "every Christian in this country thinks that those other country’s religious folk are going straight to hell" That's not true, though. It's true of the fundamentalists, and it may be true of some (most?) evangelicals, but not all Christians, and certainly not all of the people who reject evolution. As I've argued before, it's not the fundies we need to persuade. You cannot debate with someone who insists on the literal truth of the Bible above all other authority. It's the ones who just don't know any better that can and must be reasoned with. Many of them are suspicious of atheism, but respectful of faith in general. While they might instinctively respond negatively to an argument along the lines of "Well the British and the French and the Japanese all accept evolution", I think one along the lines of "Billions of Catholics, Hindus and Muslims around the world accept evolution. Evolution doesn't threaten their faith, why should it threaten yours?"

Alon, I'm well aware that there are religious nutjobs in Israel, having witnessed first-hand some of them go apeshit when a group of women tried to pray at the Wailing Wall. I'm also aware that they do not represent anything like the majority.



#15034: — 02/02  at  05:21 AM
DC said:

Thats a sad story Ron, if it is true, I’ll bet given the number of students it is a small rural school in which no one dares speak up. In short, they would certainly lose a court challenge.


Yes, it is a very poorly funded school. I'm not sure how rural it is, but it's definitely not in the city. I gave her some references (ncseweb, for example) to help her. According to her, for the faculty member who refuses to teach the evolution section, they do bring in a substitute for the 2-1/2 weeks (how's that for a message to the class??). Also, her entire budget for her class for the year is, according to her, $30. That is not a typo. They are not allowed to do anything with animals, to the point that, when she found a dead spider with an egg case and brought it in to the class, her principal made her get rid of it because it was "unsanitary."

I wish I were making this up. However, even with all of these hurdles, she is happy to be teaching there (ah, the energy and passion of the youth!! thank deity). So I take that as a good sign. At least I know that those students are exposed to someone who received a real biology education, IMO, since I was one of the people responsible for teaching her! So there's reason for optimism.



#15035: — 02/02  at  05:34 AM
Alon, I’m well aware that there are religious nutjobs in Israel, having witnessed first-hand some of them go apeshit when a group of women tried to pray at the Wailing Wall. I’m also aware that they do not represent anything like the majority.

Well, that's true... though they're a very powerful minority. As for Hinduism and Islam, do you have any evidence that these religions accept evolution? Islam sports some real reformers, who obviously do, and people who believe the Earth is flat, who obviously don't, but the question is where the mainstream lies. Given that the majority of practitioners of both religions are third-world villagers without much exposure to science, my hunch is that these religions are majority creationist. Islam and Hinduism don't have the hierarchy of Catholicism that can change religious doctrine top-down.



#15038: — 02/02  at  06:01 AM
PaperWight:

Actually, the Scots are British (I should know I'm half Scottish, and they had as much to do with the Empire as the English. Also, it was the Scots who took over England, not the other way round (James I of England, III of Scotland). Scotland also does rather well out of being part of the UK (well better than it would by itself anyway), which is why the SNP are on the verge of collapse.

True the Irish did get screwed though, but they have had a go back in the 80s and 90s, when US "charity" NorAid was sponsoring the IRA to do such friendly things as blow up Manchester city centre and the BBC, as well as Irish towns and terrorise the population of Ulster. Fair enough they did have a reason to do these things, and hopefully if Ian Paisley stops being such an arse there might be a resolution soon, but terrorism was not always as out of fashion with the US right as it is now.

Doh you've made me sound like some kind of Empire apologist now, you swine! But there are always 2 sides to every story.



#15043: — 02/02  at  08:11 AM
Living in a small midwest farming community, I am pretty confident that neither of my children have gained any understanding of evolution from their high school education. Unfortunately neither of them have any interest in science, other than what has rubbed off on them at home. I see a connection here. One of the more facinating aspects of science is the integration of biology, geology, ecology, genetics, climatology, etc. around the evolutionary core. If evolution is not central to the teaching of these sciences, providing integrative links that promote wonder and understanding, how do we impart an appreciation for science that will lead to a more scientifically literate population?

I would agree with others in some of the above posts, that this failure is indicative of a general mediocrity of education occurring in many small rural school districts.

The importance of the evolution issue cannot be understated. A public that does not appreciate how species have evolved will have little understanding of how species go extinct.



#15044: — 02/02  at  08:38 AM
Hotrockhopper, this is totally off the topic, but I thought you had to go back considerably further back in British-Irish history to find out why the Irish don't like the British. You know, thinks like trying to kill off the natives so the British could settle their lands. Kind of like the Americans did with their natives.



#15046: — 02/02  at  09:02 AM
Mark, I don't think they actively tried to kill them off, just steal their land, and not give them any potatoes.

It is quite amazing how the whole wingnut community appears to be regressing further and further back in time. They appear to be at the stage at which people tried modelling Noah's Ark according to the bible. (17th century I think). The original attempt failed when they realised just how big it would have had to have been to fit in all the new species that were being discovered by the explorers going off to Africa, Asia, America etc. What is happening in the school system, with teachers being affraid to teach evolution sounds like the Spanish Inquisition or the Witch Hunts, both in the victimisation of intellectualism and otherness. Their Man of God president is embarking on new crusades too. The only consolation is that at this rate, they should all revert to paganism and dance around naked in wood clearings by about 2015!



#15053: — 02/02  at  09:43 AM
'Not to start a religious discussion here, but DC, I think your statement about “hearing the propaganda and not the truth” might apply to your view of Catholicism'

I don't think so. Why would you assume I haven't heard the truth of the Catholic religion. My view of Catholicism is what it is based on reason, logic,the bible, and the doctrines themselves. I have no problem with what people believe, but they believe equal amounts of strange stuff.

just because they buy into evolution doesn't give the rest of their doctrines a free pass from reason.



#15056: — 02/02  at  10:00 AM
Gladys—Sometimes you just have to put things in blunt terms. While I respect people with inate diplomacy, I have come to realize that it is a quality I will never enjoy. My view stands, dual—schmual. You are either an American or you are not. Unfortunately, the State Department does not recognize any renouncing of citizenship unless they bear arms against the US. Nothing pisses me off more than parasites.



#15058: — 02/02  at  10:09 AM
We're winning some battles though ... From today's NYT.

"It's a fait accompli, it's over: Dean's going to be it," said Gerald McEntee, head of the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees, who runs the umbrella political organization for all the unions in the A.F.L.-C.I.O.



#15061: — 02/02  at  10:18 AM
Ginger Yellow -

I may have been riding the slippery slope when I said that all American Christians think all the other nation's religious people are going to hell.

But, in the context of your argument, my original premise is on the mark.

You suggest that we should tell the USA Christians:
Billions of Catholics, Hindus and Muslims around the world accept evolution. Evolution doesn’t threaten their faith, why should it threaten yours?
But, in reality, this argument is shrugged off just like the rest of them.

For (American) Christians, another's ability to accept (concede) secular ideas is a sign of weakness in his/her faith and beliefs.

Regardless, since when do Christians not think that eventually, all those other relgious people are going to hell?

Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.

-Jerry Garcia



#15062: — 02/02  at  10:36 AM
I always find it weird that conservatives (forgive me for making assumptions, but it seems reasonable here) who go on about the evils of the federal government in the same breath attack people for not being sufficiently "loyal" to the nation state they happen to have been born in. There's a lot of things I like about America. There's a lot of things I like about Britain. There's lots of things I dislike about both of them. I'll defend America when it's in the right and criticise it when it's in the wrong. If you want me to take a "My country, right or wrong" approach, then you're out of luck.

And I'd be delighted if you could tell me in what way I'm being a parasite. If I ever earn enough money as a non-resident, I'll pay US taxes as well as British taxes, yet I won't be able to benefit from Medicare when I retire, or Medicaid if I lose my job. I can't even vote in non-federal elections. I didn't cost the US education system a penny. I'm registered with the Selective Service, and if America were attacked I'd gladly serve. Likewise if Britain were attacked. What exactly is parasitic about my behaviour?



#15066: — 02/02  at  11:11 AM
"The only consolation is that at this rate, they should all revert to paganism and dance around naked in wood clearings by about 2015!"

Oh boy! I'm now looking forward to my xxth birthday, so I can wear my special birthday suit!



#15067: Jan Theodore Galkowski — 02/02  at  11:18 AM
My view stands, dual—schmual. You are either an American or you are not. Unfortunately, the State Department does not recognize any renouncing of citizenship unless they bear arms against the US. Nothing pisses me off more than parasites.

And, so, logic necessarily dictates, Richard, that you have the same impression of Israeli-Americans, since Israel also allows dual citizenship. In the British case I can understand it, since it's a holdover from empire. I don't know the history in Israel.

If so, such a position would imply strong opposition to U.S. financial support for Israel. Is that the case?



#15069: — 02/02  at  11:44 AM
Richard:

You are either an American or you are not. Unfortunately, the State Department does not recognize any renouncing of citizenship unless they bear arms against the US. Nothing pisses me off more than parasites.

I am a British citizen living and working in the US on a Green Card. I pay my taxes (without representation....oh, the irony....), and as a permanent resident I am even technically eligible for the US draft (except that at the moment I'm a little too old for it). I can't vote, and I can't sit on juries.

First question: Am I a parasite?

Next year I will be able to apply for US citizenship, which would give me the added advantage of being able to vote. I have given this matter some thought, both before and after the recent election here. If I did apply for US citizenship, Britan would still regard me as a British citizen, and I could still hold a British passport as well as a US one.

If I become a US citizen but keep my British passport, does this make me any more of a parasite than I am currently, and if so, how?



#15070: Steven Staton — 02/02  at  11:46 AM
For everyone who wishes to reject Science, I say: go for it.

And please stop using electricity, eating processed foods, driving your SUV, and making calls on your cell phone. Move out of your modern home, quit wearing manufactured clothes, and so on. Reject Science and you reject the same civilization that made it possible for you to have a hunk of processed wood with ink stains on it that you shake in people's faces to "prove" they're wrong about the shape of the Universe, and that instead you (and your heavily edited book) are "The Answer". Show some conviction in your faith. Kiss goodbye the life that Science provides you, and embrace the "nasty, brutish and short" life that Religion offers instead.



#15071: — 02/02  at  11:46 AM
Ginger Yellow: Your last post dampens some of my ire. I was under the impression (MattH, consider my arm extended for smacking) that you were in residence in the US. Good on you for registering for the draft. Yes, my views are also at once patriotic and critical. I think the last four administrations have aided and abetted illegal immigration but Bush is by far the worst, turning loose Federal prosecutors on anyone who tries to close the door.



#15073: Jan Theodore Galkowski — 02/02  at  12:21 PM
So why is it that so many bad guys in James Bond movies are British?

How do you know? Most continentals who speak English do it with a British accent. If they spoke in their native tongues, Americans would be truly clueless.

On the other hand, it might be that Americans have the sophistication of a garden slug and pride themselves in it, something Clemens often commented on and used as a comedy device. Their distrust of British and French is like envy in disguise.



#15074: Orac — 02/02  at  12:23 PM
Steven: You seem to be offering a false dilemma, which is a logical fallacy. As much as I detest creationists trying to foist their religion on everyone as "science," just because one rejects one scientific discipline (evolution) on the basis of one's religion doesn't mean that the only non-hypocritical alternative is to reject all of science and its fruits.



#15075: Jan Theodore Galkowski — 02/02  at  12:29 PM
...rather than just teaching students names of phyla and their characteristics...

<b>Alon Levy</a>, oh don't worry, soon it will be endless memorizations of genomes. wink



#15076: Jan Theodore Galkowski — 02/02  at  12:29 PM
...rather than just teaching students names of phyla and their characteristics...

Alon Levy, oh don't worry, soon it will be endless memorizations of genomes. wink



#15077: Jan Theodore Galkowski — 02/02  at  12:30 PM
What was that?



#15079: — 02/02  at  12:36 PM
Bryson Brown: FYI, when a person takes the oath of citizenship in the US, they swear allegiance to this country. So if a person joins us and then claims "dual citizenship" they are, in effect, going back on their word. In the case of Ginger Yellow, it appears he was born here but raised in Jolly Old, so as some readers less-quick-to-take-offense noticed, my attitude coppage was misplaced.

In a past life, I wasted a week's worth of liberty standing guard on a stupid (VERY stupid) born-and-raised American woman. She had married an Afghan, written a refutation of her citizenship and was living the full-on life of an Afghan wife w/brood. Suddenly, the Khaqis (Commies) shoot their way to power, slaughtering folks in a fine immitation of Old Joe and she suddenly wants to go home AND take her hubby. The Embassy had her "screw America" letter on file, and me and the rest of the Detachment had to stand back-to-back watches to keep an eye on her oddness (she was a wack job) while our politicos got hubby out of the chop-shop. Moral? Cut 'em loose. Once gone, you should be gone forever.



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