Pharyngula

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Thursday, April 29, 2004

We're the boogeymen now

From a survey on race and religion:


When questioned about what religious or nonreligious group doesn’t share their vision of American society, survey participants indicated that atheists —with 54 percent—provided the greatest threat, Hartmann said. Survey participants said Muslims create the second-highest threat.



“This result shows that religion is deeply intertwined with conceptions of American society,” he said. “The absence of faith, the belief in a higher being seems to be a major barrier between people in our society."

Well, well, well. So fear me.


(via God is for Suckers)

Trackback url: http://pharyngula.org/index/trackback/603/uCIMP05S/

Comments:
#2059: John — 04/29  at  07:41 PM
Grrr Argh! We godless hordes will ... eh... what?



#2060: Jeff — 04/29  at  08:16 PM
Um, wow. You'd think the reactionaries would push Muslims above us, but I guess not.

Well, I must go back to sacrifcing this virgin.



#2061: — 04/29  at  08:21 PM
A unbelieving friend of mine who dislikes labeling himself has a ready answer for anyone who asks what his religion is. He says he practices the same religion as his cat, whatever that is.



#2062: — 04/29  at  09:07 PM
This makes me wonder how many people call themselves "agnostics" or "nonreligious" or "spiritual but not religious", simply because "atheism" is often used as a dirty word.



#2063: Ben — 04/29  at  09:13 PM
I'd say that that 54% present the greatest threat.



#2064: — 04/29  at  09:52 PM
At least I hope they know this atheist isn't going to walk into their church with a bomb strapped to my chest.



's avatar #2065: PZ Myers — 04/29  at  10:09 PM
Yeah, Jeff has the right idea--we atheists only have the promise of virgins in this one life we get.

PZ Myers
Division of Science and Math
University of Minnesota, Morris



#2066: Barb — 04/30  at  06:15 AM
I agree with Ben -- I bet if you asked all of the atheists, agnostics, wiccans, muslims, etc. which group they thought was the biggest threat to the American way of life, the result would be 100% Christians.



#2067: Jason — 04/30  at  07:42 AM
I'd certainly like to see the questions! Consider this other "finding": "the group also found competition drives anti-Semitism — not religious intolerance. For example, [Doug Hartmann] said, some survey participants were threatened by a Jewish person’s success and not his or her religious beliefs."

Did they really expect participants to say anything else? "No, no: I hate them for believing the Sabbath falls on Saturday" or "The Festival of Lights makes me crazy" strike me as unlikely answers.



#2068: — 04/30  at  08:35 AM
I'd have liked to know what sort of threat atheists such as myself are supposed to pose. Other than to virgins, of course.



#2069: — 04/30  at  08:44 AM
<i>Did they really expect participants to say anything else?  “No, no: I hate them for believing the Sabbath falls on Saturday” or “The Festival of Lights makes me crazy” strike me as unlikely answers. </i>

If someone <i>admits</i> to anti-semitism I see no reason they should obscure why. No one said the reason for hating atheists was financial, yet the Sabbath falling on no day is just as trivial as Saturday. Amy Chua's <i>World on Fire</i> shows that dramatic ethnic differences in income <i>are</i> an incredible source of social resentment.




#2070: — 04/30  at  10:04 AM
Sometime in my early 20's, I realized that hiding one's atheism just perpeutates the problem. Black people didn't get their rights by cowering. So now I'm open about being an atheist. Though I don't advocate it any more than most christians do. And far less than some. Though about once a month I get a question like "how can you not believe in god?" So far, the best reply I've found is "How can you not believe in Santa Claus (or Zeus, or...)?" BTW, can you imagine the reaction if atheists stood on corners shouting at people to convert?



#2071: — 04/30  at  12:53 PM
I don't go around shouting my atheism, but if someone else opens the door... I'm prepared.

When asked, "Do you know Jesus" or "Have you heard the Good News" or "Do you know of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints" I reply "Yes, I have/do...You belong to one a many groups that has absolutely no objectivity about the beginnings of their own faith. And I don't let them go...they offered the penny...they're in for the pound. They really have no defense from a prepared offence. The trick is not to stop or ask a question, no matter how well formed...but to just keep talking. Some run very fast! But at least you might have made them think. I've had too much time on my hands in the past.



#2072: — 04/30  at  01:22 PM
David W. asks:

"I’d have liked to know what sort of threat atheists such as myself are supposed to pose. Other than to virgins, of course. "

I heard from distant family members (an aunt) something to the effect of "god's wrath is upon us because of all these atheists". May be the believers feel atheists are of threat the same way.

BTW I consider an atheist myself but I don't reply anything back to her just to have some peace whenever she is around (which is a couple of times a year). She is one of those types you can't argue constructively with. Heck I have even gone to the church with her few times.



#2073: Reed A. Cartwright — 04/30  at  02:01 PM
That study looks iffy to me. The statement that whites don't understand prejudice because they live in their own little worlds might be true for Wisconsin, but certainly is not true for Georgia.

I think by only going to cities, they are going to mix a hell of a lot of variation on the way ethnicities interact in America. Of course when interviewing only city-folk they are going to find ghettos and segregation.



#2074: — 04/30  at  02:33 PM
AAB, I'm not suggesting that you be a Pit Bull, or that I am when confronted by believers. I actually am the caregiver for both my elderly parents, and am surrounded by JWs all the time. I think it bothers them a bit that an atheist provides his believer parents with better care than most of them would. My mother now has Alzheimers and my father has had two strokes. I don't go looking for fights, but as Steve said, we need to be open about our atheism, especially if asked. The "tactics" I suggested above are simply the same ideas I was taught when as I child I was going door to door bothering people on Wednesday and Saturday mornings. Be polite, but firm. Never call names and be prepared with arguments that are based in rational thought. Too often, people much brighter than me get tongue tied when faced with prepared arguments, and the believer feels walks away feeling his beliefs validated. I'm just saying don't let them control the discussion. Sorry I didn't say it better before.



#2075: — 04/30  at  04:30 PM
Atheist boogeyman? But atheists have no soul.



#2076: — 04/30  at  11:46 PM

It's true though. We godless atheists are far more dangerous than religious kooks.
Just the other day I was considering strapping on a back pack of C-4 and blowing myself up at a Church. You know; to make a statement for all atheists! But then I realized I would DIE. D'oh.

Hard to blow yourself to bits when you don't believe in an afterlife...

~DS~




#2077: — 05/01  at  09:22 AM
Here in bountiful Oz the question of atheism is such a non-event that reading your conversations from the US perspective still leaves my jaw hanging.

Do you seriously have to defend yourself for being athiest? Are Americans REALLY that religious. I always thought it was one of those media distortions like all people from the Ozarks having a pin-head and marrying their cousins...



#2078: Ben — 05/01  at  10:23 AM
Don't be too smug, Andrew. It exists here too. Just on a comparatively smaller scale.



#2079: — 05/01  at  07:33 PM
There are plenty of non-fundies in the US, but they seem unwilling to challenge the fundies. Who's making fun of Biblical literalism as getting in the way of a true understanding of the Bible?

Something like:

Does Jesus Christ saying "You are the salt of the Earth" mean that you'll become pillars of salt?



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